Washing Machine Buying Guides
Why Hot Fill Is A Waste Of Time
- Created: Friday, 04 May 2007 15:15
- Last Updated: Friday, 05 August 2016 10:49
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Hot Water Fill Washing Machines
Another article explaining why for most people hot fill is a waste of time and money
All the time we get asked what machines have a hot fill and, to be perfectly honest, many engineers will struggle to understand why people want this feature as, in our opinion, it is a complete waste of time.
When we're asked about this we are often wondering, in most cases, why on Earth anyone would want a hot fill washing machine.
We are, as repair guys, sort of living in the past a little in this new found age of ecological awareness but, in the past the only machines that did a "proper" mixed hot and cold fill were old Hotpoint and Hoover washing machines (distinctly British and British made) but now with no washing machines made in the UK there is no hot fill washing machine on sale in the UK. Yet.
But these old machines were really pretty primitive and dumb. They just opened both valves and filled until the level was reached, there was no intelligence about them at all.
Later imports from Italy and beyond on occasion had a hot fill, mainly as they likely would sell less if it were omitted, but they only filled with hot water once, on one program only as did some of the Korean washing machines when they sported a hot fill valve. We explain more below.
Separating Myths From Facts
Most people think that a washing machine will fill from both the hot and cold at the same time, fact is that no current machine that we know of does this, period.
Old Hoovers and Hotpoint machines used to do so in the dim and distant past, but even they have not done this for many, many years and since both are now under Italian ownership it is also very unlikely that the feature will ever return.
You see hot fill is really pretty unique to the UK for some reason, outside of the UK there is very little, if any, demand for a hot fill. Manufacturers these days cater for either a European or global market, they are unlikely to change just for the UK.
The next point to make is that almost universally a machine that does have a hot fill capability will almost certainly only take hot water on the high temperature wash on the first fill after the pre-wash is completed. Obviously this is one of the least used programs, the most common in the UK being the 40˚C cottons wash, thus rendering the feature next to useless.
Modern Homes And Hot Fill
In the vast majority of modern UK homes the hot water is supplied either from a tank or from a combination or condenser boiler system.
This means that the water, whether it is stored or "instant" has to travel from the source to the machine itself via the home's pipework.
In reality with a modern machine this almost inevitably means that by the time that the machine has filled to level that all you've done is fill with the cold water that was lying in the plumbing and filling the pipes with that hot water that you thought you drew. This is a total waste of energy and, in the end the machine will continue and heat to the desired temperature anyway.
It also means that there will be almost no saving if indeed there is any at all, on time.
Actually, it can be seen as wasting energy as, after all what you've done is fill your pipes with hot water (that used energy to heat) only to have it dissipate away serving no purpose whatsoever. So really then, hot fill could cost you money, not save it.
Of course we have seen the argument over water that is heated via solar power and quite rightly too. But you see the same problem applies, you still have to get the water from the storage tank to the actual machine and, in any event, there's a whole load of hot water now filling your pipework that has just gone to waste.
Bear in mind that the newer the machine, especially the new A rated appliances, the intake of water is far, far lower than machines of old. A few litres of water is all they take.
Detergents And Clothing
If you use biological detergent (which we recommend you do) then if the incoming water is above 40˚C then you've just wasted the detergent. The high temperature will kill the enzymes and lower the efficiency with which the detergent will work. This may well apply for many other detergents as well as they are designed now for low temperature washing, not to work in an environment where the temperature is high and, unknown.
In short the technologies employed have changed and moved on just as they have in most areas of life and hot fill is really no longer required.
There's another problem though and one that many people probably will not consider.
There are a lot of fabrics now, especially expensive designer clothing, that must be washed correctly and, if too high a temperature is used then they are very likely to be damaged. This is known as "thermal shock" in many cases as, when the hot water hits the clothes then it can cause irreversible damage to the fibres of the garment. Again, this isn't good and damage is less likely if the temperature is gradually increased and may be avoided altogether.
Conclusion On Hot Fill
The simple conclusion is that, as you will probably now realise, that hot fill to a washing machine or even a dishwasher is that it is highly inadvisable in the case of dishwashers, pretty much a waste of time on washers and you certainly should not base your purchase decision on this feature.
But if you're really not convinced by the common sense and facts here, we expanded on this in a follow up article on why hot fill is still a waste of time in Hot Water Fill For Washing Machines Again that you can get from the link.
In that one there's an explanation of how you can do it, sort of right and some experiments that you can try at home that will demonstrate just how pointless it usually will prove to be.
If you bothered to read the article rather than scoffing, you\'d see that common sense was fully applied in respect of solar hot water.
So, if heat is coming from: woodchip boiler, gas water heater, cogeneration plant, solar thermal or heat pump it\'s most likely going to be cheaper and better for planet especially for commercial use.
We need hot fill for competitive price v.ht/LG_Steam - Here is a washing machine which is comparable and like 200 EUR cheaper than EBAC offering, We need full lifecycle analysis to see which is better.
?????????????WHO ON EARTH HAS WRITTEN THIS ARTICLE ?????
PLEASE GO AND SEARCH HOT FILL WASHING MACHINES AS THEY WILL SAVE YOU A LOT OF MONEY, PERIOD.
AS FOR THIS PIECE OF OPINION IM SURE IT IS WRITTEN FOR SIMPLE MARKETING PURPOSES , PLEASE USE YOUR COMMON SENSE.
We do try to get things like facts correct.
So unless you have rock solid proof this article is wrong then I am afraid it is merely an opinion.
Although many a marketing department will sell you a hot fill machine or the notion of one even when they know it\'s complete cobblers and, they\'ll even charge you more money to do it.
hot v coldThis article is complete rubbish!
It costs 4 to 5 times more to heat water with electricity than gas (fact!) and if you have solar heated water that is free. I have purchased an excellent old Hoover New Wave washing machine built in Wales at Merthyr Tydfil in 1993. It has hot and cold fill. Any wash cycle above 40 deg it uses the hot fill as well as the cold fill. For a 90 deg wash it exclusively uses the hot fill. Manufacturers now insist that a 90 deg drum clean cycle be run once a month or at least a 60 deg wash to prevent mould and bacteria build up . Bedding should be washed at 60 deg to remove bed mites and germs. During the winter months I have a tank of hot water sitting upstairs from the central heating system and I want to perform a 90 deg wash . There is no way its cheaper to heat the cold water in a washing machine to 90 deg using electricity and I don\'t need a smart meter either to know that just common sense. As for the cold water in the pipes I have my dishwasher connected to the hot water pipe ( yes you can do that even though they say they are only cold fill) and switch that on before I start the washing machine so the cold water has been run off or just run the hot tap till the hot water runs through or start a wash cycle without the powder in the draw , cancel it once the hot water comes through to the machine and start the cycle again with the powder in the draw. You can now buy an EBAC British made washing machine with hot and cold fill. Manufacturers need to start offering machines with hot and cold fill and let the consumers make the choice. I am sure many would choose the hot and cold fill over cold fill only.
Energy costsDafydd. You are confused over the cost of heating water. Electricity is 4-5 times the cost of gas, but heating water by gas to a cylinder is ~30% efficient. You never use all the hot water in your cylinder, so every hour you waste 1kWh from the tank, making it even less efficient. With electricity, the power station is way more efficient creating electricity and the conversion to heat in the washing machine is nearly 100%.
Got a hot fill dishwasher? I\'ll bet that runs more than your washing machine. Some brands do permit hot via the cold filler, but not many.
BTW solar HW is not free and rarely eco. You make a huge environmental impact in mining the materials, making, transporting and installing. Come midday you have a tank of hot water and the system wastes the heat to the atmosphere. Instead buy PV.
Hot fill washing machinesFui address the points against hit fill:
The water in the pipes is child therefore that\'s what the machine fills with. True that\'s how the old Hotpoint worked, but with intelligent (microprocessor ) control there is no reason not to use proportional control, I.e a mixer valve on the Hoy and child inlet. This function is well within the capability of the most basic processor, if necessary for s hot wash it could even dump water from the hot valve if below a threshold temperature and could learn the ballistics of the heating system. This is done in other systems. BTW it\'s quite common to do several machine loads one after the other so the water I in the pipes will be hit for all but the first fill.
Most people use the 40 degree cycle. As pointed out earlier, this doesn\'t kill bacteria or house dust mite lava. It was pointed out to me by a forensic biologist friend who has studied recurring leg ulcers in hospital patients that the most common form of re infection was trousers washed below 60°c as the bacteria causing the infection isn\'t killed during the wash and is then rubbed on the wound when next worn. A good ardent for washing hotter!
Hot fill, if implemented properly and installed intelligently to minimise pipe runs where possible, would give very worthwhile savings in both time and money, especially for multiple machine loads. As for low temperature washing, do this for fabrics that cannot be washed hotter, but wash bedding and citations at 60 and you\'ll going they smell fresher.
BTW,I am a man with a technical background, but I do my share of the household washing pluss part of my technical training was to understand how people use a product as design with the use case in mind, not what superficially seems line a good idea.
Let\'s hope the EBAC works out
hot & cold fill washers, I have solar water heating on roof and have just bought an EPAC british made washing m/c , happy me!! best buy in yearshot & cold fill washers, I have solar water heating on roof and have just bought an EPAC british made washing m/c , happy me!! best buy in years,highly recommend this firm in Co. Durham
We cannot tell you how it works as EBAC have not shared information on the system that they employ in those machines so, whether it is using the hot fill intelligently or just a dumb fill as most are we do not know presently. Or much else about them.
But all the comments above and in other articles stand nonetheless in respect to hot fill.
If you are happy though, so be it.